The Oral History of Nothing With Numbers (Vegas Archive)

Jul 29, 2014 Posted by Emily Matview In Oral History, Vegas Archive Tagged Nothing With Numbers Comments 0

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Welcome to Vegas Archive, a feature where we re-release music from local bands that are gone, but certainly not forgotten.

Today we’re bringing you ‘We Kill Some Time’ from local punk/hardcore band Nothing With Numbers, who were active from 2008 to 2011, and have played sporadic shows since then.

For more information about the band and these songs, read the oral history as told by Nothing With Numbers members Dave Bartlett [drums], Mike Law [guitar], Sean Maphis [vocals], Tyler Newton [bass] and Brett Wilson [guitar], as well as other musicians and friends who knew the band.

“Not one of these guys is from Vegas. Lucky enough to have met each other in 2008, Nothing With Numbers has produced powerful and energetic heavy music. You never know what to expect for a live performance, as their set can quickly change pace and intensity. Not one thing about this band is common, they are the opposite of genre peaceable and all 5 members share love for kittens.”

-Nothing With Numbers (Reverbnation)

Shared love of a Jersey band – and Craigslist – created the foundation for bringing a group of musicians from different parts of the country together.

Brett Wilson, Nothing With Numbers guitarist:

I posted an ad on Craigslist about me being a pop-punk guitarist that recently moved back to Vegas and that I was looking for people to play with. Mikey [Law, guitar] answered my post because I included Bigwig as one of my influences. Since he was from Bigwig’s hometown in Jersey, he was interested.

Mike Law, Nothing With Numbers guitarist

My friend Kelley [Karas, currently of The Negative Nancys] showed me a Craigslist post that said something like “26 year old guitar player into Strung Out, Lagwagon, NOFX, Bigwig, etc. I want to play some punk, some metal.” Kelley asked me if I posted it *laughs*.

Kelley Karas, (current The Negative Nancys guitarist, vocalist)

Before the days of Facebook, back in the dark ages of IRC, AIM and Myspace – Mike and I were both Craigslist aficionados.

Mike Law

Brett and I started talking. We met at the Ice House for Guttermouth, and I think Holding Onto Sound played. We met one time, then I left town for a couple months, back to New Jersey. We recorded videos and stuff and sent them back and forth. I still have those videos, and some of that became our songs. After I got back, Brett and I got together a few times to write and gradually become exactly the best friends that we both needed at that point in our lives.

Brett Wilson

When we started jamming we brought parts of our own songs together and we immediately started making our punk/metal-infused style. Kelley had also jammed with Dave [Bartlett, drums] a few times.

Kelley Karas

Mike was into more hardcore/post punk stuff than I was – I wanted to be in Jimmy Eat World part 2 *laughs*. But since I thought he was good at guitar and he had more experience with band stuff, I’d asked him to help me/play with people (i.e. Dave) that I’d met through the Myspace classified ads

Brett Wilson

Kelley told Mikey that Dave would probably like playing with us.

Dave Bartlett, Nothing With Numbers drummer:

When I first moved out to Vegas, the only person I knew was my BFF Matt Abbott, who had helped me get a job out here. I’m forever appreciative of this. I had an itch to get into a band and start playing some fast stuff again. So I got on Myspace to look for musicians in the community. I found an ad from Kelley looking to start a punk band. After a few back and forth messages we decided to set up a day to jam at her place.

Kelley Karas

Mike and Dave met at my father’s house and we made noise. At that point, Mike was like “Dave’s so awesome at drums, he’s mine!” The stake was claimed.

Dave Bartlett

I don’t remember exactly what we played but we tried out a few riffs and maybe a cover. We got around to talking about what styles we enjoyed playing.

Mike Law

I was playing guitar and did some Pennywise, Millencolin and Rise Against, all of which Dave knew. Kelley liked him, but we had obviously hit it off. Dave said, “That’s what I like to play, but no one in Vegas wants to play that fast.” I turned my guitar down and called Brett, who echoed that statement. I believe Kelley and Dave heard the whole conversation. Brett said, “Bring him over here next weekend.”

Dave Bartlett

After a week or so we finally had a time to meet up and jam up at Brett’s place. Little did I know, I was jamming with my future best friends. If memory serves me right, we knocked out two songs in that first meeting: “Song 1” and “Song 2” [Numbers songs were all called by numbers]. It was a lot of fun getting those first two songs down. Musically, we all clicked very quickly.

Brett Wilson

And so the first three pieces of the five-piece were together.

Mike Law

Dave, Brett, and I wrote four or five songs, started playing at MDV Entertainment regularly, and knew we needed to find a singer and bass player. But we agreed that we should name the band before we added anyone else. I said that I didn’t want anything that started with the word “The.” Dave said, “Yeah, and nothing with numbers…. Wait, that’s my suggestion!”

With a solid foundation and name in place, Nothing With Numbers began looking for a singer and bassist.

Brett Wilson

We wanted to sound like a mid-nineties, Fat Wreck-style band with some modern influences. But we struggled trying to find a singer for a while. No Use for a Name’s “International You Day” was our tryout song for both singers and bassists. Some people could nail it, but didn’t see eye to eye with us on what we wanted to do, which was to make some original music and have fun doing it. Dave told us that Sean [Maphis, vocals] had expressed an interest in singing – or screaming, which would be the correct term – for us.

Dave Bartlett

I had a job for an AV company at the Rio and unbeknownst to me, Sean was working for the same company at Planet Hollywood. Apparently Sean and I looked very similar back then with our shaggy hair, and numerous people thought I was him. Finally, after a couple visits helping out at Planet Hollywood, I ran into Sean. I could see the resemblance: we were both pretty sexy humans. We hit it off pretty well. He was an audio guy and I was a video guy so we worked well on shows together.

Sean Maphis, Nothing With Numbers vocalist

I worked with Dave for some time, and we became good friends even before he mentioned he was in a band. We talked about music and comics at work. I was really excited when he told me about the band and that they were punk and looking for a singer. When I told Dave that I was interested in trying out, he kind of shrugged it off, saying they had found someone who seemed to be working out.

Mike Law

At one point, we had a singer who came to like 5 practices, but never sang. We had a singer/bass player who was great, but thought we weren’t heavy enough and didn’t like the fast changes in the songs. We had a bass player who thought we weren’t punk enough, and spent most of time telling us about all the people he knew and why NOFX was popular and why we should be doing that and scaling back on the crazy songs with lots of parts. We just stopped talking to that guy.

Sean Maphis

A month or two passed before I asked Dave again how things were going and he said the singer they had was out of the picture and this time we set up a tryout time at MDV, which would become my home away from home.

Mike Law

When Sean came over with Dave, he introduced himself, shook hands with me and Brett, picked up the mic and said, “Dave showed me your stuff, play something.” We played and he literally started jumping to get the groove. Then he started screaming. Loud.

Brett Wilson

Sean just grabbed a mic and started screaming into it with his own melody and started jumping around the small room at MDV like he was a freaking rockstar. It was very impressive. The screaming wasn’t the direction we wanted to go in, but he was amazing and we thought we should try to expand our thinking.

Sean Maphis

Though I was nervous, I immediately saw an opening for my “harder” vocal style. Working in some pre-written lyrics, I dove in head first and started screaming my head off the best I could to their original songs. I recognized these guys were hoping to go in more of a pop-punk direction with the band and were quite surprised when I just laid into some unrelenting screaming verses.

Mike Law

I thought he was good, but wondered if it would work. Brett and I talked that through and agreed that if what we had done so far felt right, then this might be a perfect next step.

Sean Maphis

I left thinking not much would come of it, but was happy when I received a rough recording of “Number 4” to do what I could with. I worked out vocals and lyrics and the next time we met we played it all the way through, ending with a somewhat confused silence. The guys were stoked about my energy and presence, and were equally surprised that what just happened kind of worked.

Mike Law

We worked with Sean a bit, he started sending lyrics and always showing up with a ton of ideas. He had really good thoughts on the music, too. He wanted to add more stops and heavy parts. Dave wanted the fast parts faster. The music took a big step quickly. Then Sean said he had a bass player who would join us and we were like, “Okay, you’re in.”

Dave Bartlett

Sean mentioned he had a roommate that might be interested in playing bass for us. We said, “Bring him on down next time.” Lo and behold, the next practice introduced us to “Mr. Bass Face” himself: Tyler Newton. Life would never be the same.

Tyler Newton, Nothing with Numbers bassist

I had met Sean when I was working as a stagehand. I was playing in a band at the time called The Lucky Dirties with Jarad Davis from Metasopheli. Very fast punk rock, done-in-under-two-minutes kind of songs. We needed a singer, so I had asked Sean if he wanted to jam. We gave it a practice: The Lucky Dirties with Sean at the helm. It was pretty awesome; Sean can just perform. He’s fearless. For personal reasons, the band ended up breaking up a few weeks later.

Sean Maphis

I had attempted to jam with Tyler years prior, but it didn’t work out. Honestly I didn’t even know that the project had a name *laughs*. It never went anywhere and we never played any shows.

Tyler Newton

Sean called me and asked if I owned a bass. At the time I didn’t, but my girlfriend did. He asked if I would be interested in jamming with this band he knew called Nothing with Numbers and that it would be a package deal for them, gaining two members at the same time. I said I was in, having never played bass in a band before. Sean sent me their Myspace link to check out. I couldn’t believe how fast and transitional everything was. Plus, they had influences like Bigwig and Strung Out. I had never met anybody else that listened to those bands.

Brett Wilson

Tyler seemed like he really liked what we were doing and was very talented. He’s a pretty quiet guy, but very smart and would always try to help with our overall sound as a band.

Mike Law

Tyler just blew me away. Here’s a sci-fi fan who likes a variety of music and can play lots of stuff. He had lots of ideas on sound. He fixed the tone conflict between Brett’s and my guitars. He wanted to balance things out, get the low end bass parts right where they needed to be.

Tyler Newton

Mikey and Brett came over to Sean’s house to meet up with me for the first time. I had my bass and a little practice amp. I remember them being really nice; they didn’t make me feel awkward. They played us a new song and I asked what tuning they were in. Turned out they were a full step down tuned. I had never played in that low of tuning. It makes your strings looser, and harder to play fast if you don’t have the right gauge. So I tuned up, and they started showing me “Song 4” and “ Song 7.”

Sean Maphis

It soon became obvious that we had a solid group of guys with an aligned objective: play rad shows.

With its members fully in place, the new group of friends quickly began playing shows in Vegas and California.

Sean Maphis

We moved in a heavier direction with the songwriting and started playing shows, the first being at East Side Joe’s.

Tyler Newton

It was so hot! But we got to play with TheCore., HOTS and Hit the Switch. We were stoked.

Chris Duggan, TheCore. drummer, Unfair Fight guitarist

My band [TheCore.] was playing the same show, otherwise I would’ve never been there *laughs*. I distinctly remember being very impressed by their unique, creative and often confusing music. They didn’t sound like ANYONE else in Vegas, which was refreshing. After meeting the five unusually nice dudes who made up the band, I became a huge fan.

Dave Bartlett

Nothing With Numbers shows were always an interesting thing with us in the lineup. Little too heavy for punk but not heavy enough for metal. We played with a variety of bands. Many of which would become our dear friends in time.

Zabi Naqshband, former HOTS bassist, current Illicitor bassist

Those guys were so much fun! Sean was great to watch. His voice reflected the faces he made. You can’t sing like that and not look like you’re about to scream your vocal cords right out of your throat. Whenever we played with them, they were usually the only hardcore band, so it was fun to see people react to the music.

Sean Maphis

We became inseparable among ourselves and made great friendships with so many members of the local scene. Without bands like TheCore., Deadhand, Holding Onto Sound, The Quitters, Fat Dukes of Fuck, Asterionella, Sic Waiting (CA), Eken is Dead (CA), Being Jared (CA) and many others giving us support and brotherhood over the years we wouldn’t still be jamming. Thank you dudes!

Tommy AK, The Quitters guitarist

One event stands out from the all the other shows, where we were lucky enough to get our faces melted by NWN. It was at the Bunkhouse [Saloon], sometime before 2011. As Sean was doing his thing up front, screaming like a banshee and jumping around like the floor was on fire, he swung his mic cord above his head like a helicopter blade. It seemed like the radius of the swing lengthened with each revolution. Then I heard a “Pop!” Tyler’s face had just been annihilated by the swinging microphone of death. Even as he was dazed and confused by the sudden impact, Tyler never stopped thrashing on his bass even as the blood slowly trickled down the side of his face. The set continued, as if nothing happened because let’s be blunt here, this did not seem out of place at a NWN gig. I absolutely loved playing shows with them.

Brett Wilson

I think my favorite show we played was in Oceanside at Pier View Pub. We played with Sic Waiting, Being Jared and Eken is Dead. That was a blast!

Mike Law

The place was jammed. I think there was a point where you had to wait for someone to go outside to smoke before they would let another person in. We play second or third to a crowd who had never heard us and had no idea who we were. The reaction and the energy was like nothing I had experienced. There was a point where I said, “These people REALLY like us!” I don’t think I slept that weekend. I wanted every show to be that. It was the “purple dragon” of stage performances. People were coming up to us all night asking when we were coming back.

Vic Arevalo, Eken is Dead guitarist

Eken Is Dead met Nothing With Numbers way back in 2010 through a dubious character named Jared Stinson of Sic Waiting, when we were on a bill together at Pier View. That was a glorious time for us as we were playing a ton of shows, touring quite a bit and subsequently meeting awesome bands left and right. Nothing With Numbers were total sweethearts from the get-go and we hit it off with them immediately. Thinking back, that show we played with them was probably the wildest and most fun Pier View show we have played, complete with bouncers floating the crowd and everything.

Once the band’s setlist was solidified and mastered, Nothing With Numbers began work recording what would be their one and only full length.

Tyler Newton

I recorded, produced and mixed all the songs along with my friend Ryan Zuch.

Dave Bartlett

They had a rig and it was free. Perfect combination *laughs*.

Tyler Newton

We recorded drums at Ryan’s house.

Dave Bartlett

I had never recorded before or even played to a click.

Ryan Zuch, co-producer

Dave brought his kit over and set up in my “recording room,” which was really just an empty living room. He played through a couple of songs with the click track and told us he was ready. We hit the “Record” button and he laid down pretty much everything. We went through and touched up a couple of troubled spots and called it a day.

Mike Law

After we recorded scratch tracks at Ryan’s house, I started going to Tyler’s place and recorded in his bedroom.

Tyler Newton

I would record their guitars out of my closet in my house.

Mike Law

Fun Facts: I cannot play well to a click, I cannot hear distinctions in tone and therefore do not care, and I cannot conceptualize the finished product today. The only things I care about when I am recording are accuracy and consistency… and the ability to metal out for five minutes to get my head clear. Great for me… Probably pretty frustrating for Tyler *laughs*. And I probably apologized to him 80 times and I still owe him a few.

Ryan Zuch

We would do a lot of the main vocals in a couple of longer sessions. After getting the main vocals mixed in, we did a couple of smaller sessions where backup vocals and group vocals were recorded.

Tyler Newton

All Sean’s vocals were recorded in the closet. We did a gang vocals session with the band, Brock Frabbiele and Sal Giordano of TheCore., and a few others.

Brett Wilson

Tyler is a patient dude. He put up with our dumb pickiness. He has a great ear for it. And he’s very knowledgeable about how to improve things.

Sean Maphis

Recording was tough because of everyone’s schedules. It lengthened the process to longer than it needed to be or ever should have been for anyone ever in the history of recording *laughs*.

Dave Bartlett

We had a few more songs in our arsenal and wanted to get them recorded. Luckily our good buddy Chris Duggan was getting into recording and wanted to have us come by. We followed the same process we did before with live scratch. It went much quicker than last time, considering it was only three songs. That process was a lot looser because the schedule wasn’t so tight to record. We might have recorded everything but vocals that day or within a day or two. We lumped those onto the discs with the other recording sessions and had 12 pieces of craziness.

Tyler Newton

We never had a physical release of the disc. It was finished just at the time when we slowed down. So we gave away all the music for free.

Dave Bartlett

We thought about putting together a real booklet and CD but never really pulled the trigger. We even had some sketched artwork done by the wonderful Joelle Jones for our cover. We figured burning the discs and handing them out was good enough, though. Maybe one day we’ll get around to putting it fully together. But for now, we’ll keep burning them.

Nothing With Numbers began to play less frequently as major life events took focus, culminating in Brett’s decision to leave Vegas to further his career.

Dave Bartlett

I believe we were at Osaka getting sushi for someone’s birthday. We were laughing and having a jolly time. Then Brett said he had something to say to us. “Guys, I’m moving to Kansas City for an apprenticeship.” I believe he was leaving within a week.

Brett Wilson

I had so much fun playing with those guys, but I had to move to begin my path of starting a career as a power lineman. I had to move to San Diego to get some experience in and then I moved to Kansas City, MO to go through an apprenticeship program.

Sean Maphis

It was sad to hear that Brett was leaving, but everyone was super happy for him. We knew Nothing With Numbers was not our future and we only wanted what was best for each other.

Dave Bartlett

We are more than bandmates; we’re great friends who happened to be in a band. As short notice as it was, we were all pretty excited for Brett to start his new career path, and this was a big step for him. We managed to schedule a final show with him at Yayo [Taco] with our friends Unfair Fight.

Mike Law

Then we all became busy with important things at just the right time. I focused on my career in hospitality and started doing comedy shows, variety shows, the Balloonmaster Show, and Evil Dead The Musical. Dave started playing with any band that needed a drummer ever, Sean got married and switched gears in his career, Tyler was increasing his role in Punk In Vegas and other creative projects. Everyone kind of said, “Well I am doing these other great things and we will always be friends.”

Dave Bartlett

We knew it wasn’t exactly the end, but it was certainly a temporary stopping point.

With Brett gone, the band regrouped with a new fifth member but played less frequently, as other obligations took precedence.

Sean Maphis

We played a show or two with Mikey as the only guitarist before eventually filling a guitarist spot with the genius of Chris Duggan.

Chris Duggan

After Brett moved across the continent to further his career in pole smoking *laughs*, the band played a few shows without him. I saw the Bunkhouse show without Brett and they sounded WAY better *laughs*. They obviously wanted to keep the band going, so they asked if I would be into filling in, and I most certainly was.

Sean Maphis

Bringing Duggan into the fold was a natural choice, he loved fast and hard music and was a good dude who always showed us, and our music, more genuine interest than we got from most other bands’ members we were sharing the stage with.

Jared Stinson, Sic Waiting frontman

Dave started touring with my band, Sic Waiting. He’s a goofy fucker that fits in perfect because besides being a damn good drummer and down to travel, he’s also sober and willing to drive after the shows. And he’s a big fan of Del Taco.

Mike Law

I’m still making music, playing with Aaron Cannon, who I also met through Kelley when I subbed on bass in Asterionella. Aaron recorded a few songs that I had laying around, two of which were unused Numbers songs. We played one show in February under the name Glass Houses. Our band City & State will be ready to book shows this summer. We are warming up and writing tons of music. The goal was to write lots of music and maybe play occasionally.

Sean Maphis

With jobs, babies and the like, we all kept close but played less, coming together for the odd birthday party or annual jam. It’s a tradition I hope to keep for many years. And we never lost sight of our love of the music.

Tyler Newton

In the future we might start writing again since Brett is now back on the West Coast. We would keep Duggan in the band too and have three guitar players.

Brett Wilson

I’m journeyman lineman now and I work in San Diego. I plan on moving back to Vegas in the future, but I am focused on my career now. I still play and when it’s possible to get some of the Numbers guys in the same room at the same time, we set up jam sessions. We practiced a couple months back for the first time in a long time and it was a blast. We all have crazy schedules now, so getting together is hard, but we will always try to play music.

Chris Duggan

With Brett back on the West Coast (and in our hearts), I was almost certain my days in NWN were over, but they decided to keep me around as the 3rd guitar player, which makes the band even more confusing, chaotic and unlistenable. If you don’t know what I mean you can get all their (our) stuff on PunksInVegas.com or on Bandcamp for free. But be careful – once you hear it you can’t unhear it.

Mike Law

We still hang out, we’re still involved in each other’s lives and creative projects, and every so often, we get together and play. We put a lot of work into building this band and these relationships with each other. It was all really important to me and exactly what I needed in my life. And it kind of went away at exactly the right time, but is still there when I need it. I realized that we were playing music that we liked and that was perfect.

Sean Maphis

Nothing With Numbers never really did spectacular things as a band but the brotherhood we developed throughout that time was always the most important thing.

Dave Bartlett

Nothing with Numbers has been an intricately significant part of my life. It helped me express myself musically and opened up Vegas for me to meet new people outside of work. We were just five buddies playing some tunes having a good time. I gained four of the best friends I will always have in my life. Thank you for everything.